Razor Blades in Apples, Candy Corn Conundrum & Pumpkin Spice Everything

George Duran: 00:00:00

Real or fake formula?

P. Yellow lemonade flavored sour liquid candy packaged to resemble a urine sample collected at a doctor's office.

Karla Walsh: 00:00:08

Gross.

No, that's fake.

George Duran: 00:00:10

It's real.

Karla Walsh: 00:00:11

No.

Who.

Why does this exist?

George?

George Duran: 00:00:18

Welcome to the Always Hangry Podcast, where we break down the way we eat.

The good, the bad, and the completely ridiculous.

I'm your host, George Duran.

Today we're unwrapping some of Halloween's sweetest secrets, from tainted apples to candy corn that taste like candles.

And later on, we're diving into the pumpkin spice craze.

How it took over America, why we're obsessed with it, and whether we've finally taken it too far.

Joining me now is the only person who brings a snorkel to Bob for Apples, the delightfully spooky Karla Walsh.

Karla Walsh: 00:00:49

I mean, honestly, I wouldn't put it past me.

You got to be prepared for everything.

George.

George Duran: 00:00:53

Have you ever bopped for apples?

Karla Walsh: 00:00:55

I think when I was a little kid.

Yeah.

George Duran: 00:00:58

I don't see anyone do that anymore.

Karla Walsh: 00:00:59

I know.

What.

What made that stop.

Should we bring it back?

George Duran: 00:01:02

I think kids were probably drowning.

Karla Walsh: 00:01:04

Oh, I. I mean, I hope not.

George Duran: 00:01:06

Well, the secret to bobbing for apples, that because the apples float, you have to push the apple down into the water until it hits the bottom of the container, and then you can grasp it with your teeth.

You can't just grasp it from the tip of the water.

Karla Walsh: 00:01:17

Yeah, yeah, that does sound kind of dangerous.

George Duran: 00:01:19

But speaking of apples, do you remember the whole thing about razor blades and apples?

Karla Walsh: 00:01:24

Yes.

Was that true?

George Duran: 00:01:25

Yeah.

Well, for decades, American parents warned children that a stranger might put a razor blade inside their Halloween apple.

Years after research, there's still no substantiated case of a child being killed or injured by this.

Karla Walsh: 00:01:38

Wow.

Do we know where this rumor got started?

George Duran: 00:01:40

Well, in: 1968

And then in the 70s, the New York Times published a sensational article titled, those Treats May be tricks, warning parents that the plump red apple that your kid gets from a kindly old woman down the block may have a razor blade hidden inside.

What the hell's wrong with us?

Karla Walsh: 00:02:06

I have.

I have so many questions.

A, who was handing out apples on Halloween?

And like, B, like, where did these rumors begin?

This is so, so wild.

George Duran: 00:02:19

There has been zero recorded evidence of a child ever being killed or seriously injured by a random stranger hiding a razor blade or poison in a Halloween treat.

So it is not true.

It's complete myth.

Karla Walsh: 00:02:30

So you are the parent in this conversation.

I would love to know.

Do you sort through your kids Halloween candy before they eat it?

George Duran: 00:02:37

Yeah, so I can eat the good stuff and they can have the crap waxy candy instead.

Karla Walsh: 00:02:43

What do you steal?

George Duran: 00:02:44

Anything.

Peanut butter.

But that's because also my youngest kid is allergic to peanut butter.

But it's kind of an excuse too.

Karla Walsh: 00:02:49

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, safety first.

George Duran: 00:02:51

Yeah, okay, sure, whatever.

I want the peanut butter.

Dr. Joel Best, a sociologist and criminal justice professor at the University of Delaware, found that the vast majority of reports were hoaxes about the razor blades.

Children seeking attention from anxious parents would stick a sewing pin or blade into a candy bar and claim they found it.

When pressed by police, almost all of them admitted it was a joke.

Karla Walsh: 00:03:14

Wow.

That's not funny.

George Duran: 00:03:17

Those kids deserve the razor blade in their apple.

Yeah, these kids are seeking attention.

That's it.

Karla Walsh: 00:03:23

Wow.

George Duran: 00:03:23

Here is the reason why razor blazing apple are pretty much impossible or impractical, I should say oxidation.

Apples are highly susceptible to rapid oxidation.

The moment an apple skin is punctured and the flesh is exposed to air, the enzymatic browning process begins.

It would start rotting right away if you put a razor blade in there.

Karla Walsh: 00:03:43

Yeah.

Or at least getting visibly brown.

You know, as we've all seen when we have cut slices of apple out for snacking.

George Duran: 00:03:50

Absolutely.

Visibility is another reason to embed a standard double edged razor blade, someone would have to make a deep, wide slit into the core of the fruit.

This cut cannot be seamlessly closed or concealed.

Like how do you stick a double edged razor blade into an apple?

Like with pliers.

And how do you even do that?

Karla Walsh: 00:04:08

Yeah, it would be extremely like an engineering feat to make that happen.

And again, I go back to who is handing out apples on Halloween.

George Duran: 00:04:17

And then there's deterioration.

By the time the apple sits in a giveaway bowl and handed to a child, bounced around in a trick or treat bag, it was finally brought home and it was pretty much starting to rot.

You can instantly tell if this apple, there's something wrong with it.

Yeah, I came up with a candied apple treat one time that had the whole razor blade theme to it.

And what I did was I made these like cookies that were shaped as razor blades.

You dip the apple in the caramel and then I made a slit in the apple and kind of pushed in this cookie that looked like a razor blade into the side of the apple and served it like that.

Karla Walsh: 00:04:50

Okay.

I hope you were serving this to adults with like a sign.

George Duran: 00:04:54

No, it was kind of fun and dark humor.

And people loved it because they could eat candy apples with a cookie that was razor blade shaped.

Karla Walsh: 00:05:02

You're making the narrative your own, George.

That's creative.

George Duran: 00:05:04

But no doubt if somebody were to give me an apple for Halloween, I would just chuck it right back up there.

Front window.

No, George, you cannot give apples for Halloween.

Nobody, no kid wants apples for Halloween.

Karla Walsh: 00:05:15

Oh, gosh.

George Duran: 00:05:15

You know what I give out for Halloween?

Karla Walsh: 00:05:17

What's that?

George Duran: 00:05:18

Packets of ramen.

Karla Walsh: 00:05:19

No way.

George Duran: 00:05:20

Every year I give up packets of ramen and I am the most popular house on the block here.

Karla Walsh: 00:05:25

Yeah, I was gonna say that's a hit.

George Duran: 00:05:27

It's dirt cheap and it's ramen and it's something that's not sweet.

Parents love it.

Kids love it even more.

Karla Walsh: 00:05:33

Yeah, I mean, that's like a good post trick or treating meal.

George Duran: 00:05:37

Honestly, this is what's really happened for in terms of tampering for food.

In: 1959

William V. Syine distributed approximately 450 candy coated laxatives to trick or treaters.

Around 30 children became ill. Why would you do that?

In: 1964

Karla Walsh: 00:06:08

Oh my gosh, that is awful.

George Duran: 00:06:12

I'm not joking to you.

I get a lot of adults trick or treating in my neighborhood.

All I can think in my head is like, man, you're too old for this.

Get the hell out of here.

But I still give it to them.

I don't say anything but to give them ant traps and dog biscuits.

Karla Walsh: 00:06:26

That makes me sad.

That lady is a party pooper.

George Duran: 00:06:28

Trick or treating is not for adults.

Karla Walsh: 00:06:30

I'm sorry, I'm a zero judgment zone.

If you want to come knock on my door, that's okay.

George Duran: 00:06:34

Okay, we're going to play a game called treat or trash.

Karla Walsh: 00:06:38

Okay, I'll figure it out as we go along.

Yes, I'm ready.

George Duran: 00:06:42

The way it works is very simple.

I'm going to tell you the name of some outrageous candies and you have to tell me if they are real candy treats or if I invented them.

Karla Walsh: 00:06:50

Okay, I'm ready.

George Duran: 00:06:51

Barf jelly beans, Real or fake?

Karla Walsh: 00:06:55

That I believe was part of the Harry Potter jelly belly series.

I'm going to say real.

George Duran: 00:07:02

That's correct.

These jelly beans deliberately flavored to taste like actual vomit.

Made by jelly belly.

Come on, people.

Karla Walsh: 00:07:08

Again, why are we doing this to ourselves?

George Duran: 00:07:10

Next, one zombie toenail clippings fake or real?

Karla Walsh: 00:07:14

That has to be fake.

George Duran: 00:07:16

These tiny, sour, yellowish candy shards are packed inside a plastic nail clipper dispenser.

Karla Walsh: 00:07:21

Oh, gross.

George Duran: 00:07:22

And they're fake.

Karla Walsh: 00:07:24

Ah, good.

I was just like, this cannot be real.

Who would pay good money for that?

George Duran: 00:07:30

All right, how about this one?

Belly button lint.

Fake gray cotton candy that resembles belly button fuzz with a sour blue raspberry center.

Karla Walsh: 00:07:38

I'm gonna say that's fake.

George Duran: 00:07:39

That is fake.

I made.

Yeah, yeah.

Sour flush.

A miniature plastic toilet filled with sour candy powder.

You dip a candy plunger into the bowl and lick it.

Karla Walsh: 00:07:50

Oh, I think that's real.

It's like a fun dip, but like in a playful package.

I'm gonna say real.

George Duran: 00:07:56

That's totally real.

It's made by Kids Mania.

And my kids love it.

Love it.

How about this one?

Pickled eyeballs.

Gummy eyeballs with a liquid dill pickle flavor center that bursts when bitten.

Karla Walsh: 00:08:09

Okay, well, I mean, pickle everything is out there, so I'm gonna say that has to be real.

George Duran: 00:08:13

That is not real.

Karla Walsh: 00:08:14

Darn, that was a good made up one.

George Duran: 00:08:16

George Box of boogers.

Sour gummy boogers and flavors including Snotermelon Slime Apple and Sour Green Boogie.

Karla Walsh: 00:08:24

I'm gonna say that's real.

Kids love a booger joke.

George Duran: 00:08:27

Yeah.

Flixcandi made this.

It's real.

All right.

Denture chews.

Pink bubblegum pieces that unfold into a full set of edible dentures.

Karla Walsh: 00:08:36

That is so fake.

George Duran: 00:08:38

That is fake.

Formula P. Yellow lemonade flavored sour liquid candy packaged to resemble a urine sample collected at a doctor's office.

Karla Walsh: 00:08:47

Gross.

No, that's fake.

George Duran: 00:08:50

It's real.

Karla Walsh: 00:08:51

No.

Karla Walsh: 00:08:52

Who.

Karla Walsh: 00:08:54

Why does this exist?

George Duran: 00:08:55

George, it's made by.

Can you imagine that?

Yellow lemonade flavored sour liquid candy packaged to resemble a urine sample.

Yep.

Karla Walsh: 00:09:03

No, I can't imagine that.

Why?

Why?

Why does this need to exist?

Just put it in a regular bottle.

George Duran: 00:09:08

That's really gross.

Sewer sludge, slurps, chocolate syrup, and tiny plastic drain pipes designed to look like sewage being squeezed into your mouth.

Karla Walsh: 00:09:17

Oh, my gosh.

Well, on the heels of that, I'm gonna say that has to be real, even though I want it to be fake.

George Duran: 00:09:22

We're gonna stop at poop.

This is fake.

Karla Walsh: 00:09:25

Okay, okay.

Well, that's where the line is then, George.

George Duran: 00:09:29

Candy urine, totally fine.

Candy poop.

Eh, I don't know.

Pick and lick Earwax.

An oversized edible cotton swab that you dip in earwax colored candy powder.

Karla Walsh: 00:09:39

Oh, gross.

Now I'm on the Fence.

Because we had the toilet plunger, which was also okay.

Oh.

Oh.

I'm, like, right in the middle.

I'm gonna say it's fake.

George Duran: 00:09:50

It's real.

Karla Walsh: 00:09:52

No.

Oh, I'm so bad at.

George Duran: 00:09:55

Yeah.

In: 2013

Karla Walsh: 00:10:02

Oh, my gosh.

I wonder how many of these still exist of the ones that are actually real.

George Duran: 00:10:06

Toe jam taffy striped taffy combining sweet blueberry and pungent blue cheese flavors.

Karla Walsh: 00:10:12

Oh, gross.

Did not really need that in my life.

I'm gonna say fake.

George Duran: 00:10:19

It is fake.

I made that one up.

Karla Walsh: 00:10:21

Yes.

I mean, blue cheese flavored.

Gross.

George Duran: 00:10:24

Lick your wounds.

Candy scabs.

Fake adhesive bandages that open to reveal edible pressed sugar candy scabs.

Karla Walsh: 00:10:31

Oh, I'm gonna have nightmares.

George, that has to be fake.

George Duran: 00:10:34

It's real.

Karla Walsh: 00:10:36

No.

Oh, my word.

Who is thinking this is a good idea?

When they're like these?

Brainstorm.

Meaning, Just imagine sitting there.

I know.

We need edible scabs made by Cap.

George Duran: 00:10:47

Candy, a division of Hasbro.

Of course, this is in: 2006

You could refill the bandages with more candy scabs if you wanted.

Karla Walsh: 00:10:54

I don't.

George Duran: 00:10:56

Next up, use tissue chews.

Wadded up raspberry taffy with a gooey lemon center made to resemble a used tissue.

Karla Walsh: 00:11:03

Come on.

I'm going to say fake.

George Duran: 00:11:06

Gosh, you know me so well.

It is fake.

Karla Walsh: 00:11:09

Finally got one right.

George Duran: 00:11:11

But we should invent these used tissue chews.

That would be amazing.

Karla Walsh: 00:11:15

Oh, my gosh.

I mean, like, isn't that, like, every grandma, like, has, like, the used tissues, like, up their sleeve or something, and.

George Duran: 00:11:22

It comes in the box of Kleenex, you know, that little square box, and you pull it out and you eat it as you go.

I think we need to take a nausea break here, right?

Karla Walsh: 00:11:30

Yes, please.

I could use a deep breath.

George Duran: 00:11:32

Okay, when we come back, we're talking corn.

Candy corn, of course.

And later, how did pumpkin spice go from a simple seasonal flavor to full blown national obsession?

We're talking to an expert who'll help us make sense of America's pumpkin spice madness.

Stick around.

All right, we're back with Karla Walsh on this always hangry Halloween special.

Do you like candy corn, Karla?

Karla Walsh: 00:12:18

I am fully team candy corn.

Specifically, if I could choose, I want those Mallow pumpkins because it's like candy corn, but larger.

I want it all.

It's straight sugar to my veins.

George Duran: 00:12:28

But isn't it, like, super waxy?

And it has a weird Chew right?

Karla Walsh: 00:12:31

Yes.

That's part of the appeal.

George Duran: 00:12:34

In the: 1880

And then in: 1898

And that helped turn it into a national product.

The candy was sold under the name chicken feed.

Karla Walsh: 00:13:01

How do you feel about candy corn, George?

George Duran: 00:13:03

I hate it.

It's just wax, Sweet, chewy wax that it just doesn't even melt in your mouth.

Like that's not worth the calories.

It's not.

Karla Walsh: 00:13:11

I'll take your candy corn.

I do feel like that's one of the more polarizing Halloween candies.

That's for sure.

George Duran: 00:13:16

Yeah.

You know what I like using candy corn for?

Karla Walsh: 00:13:18

What's that?

George Duran: 00:13:19

I take a hot glue gun and I take a small little white pumpkin and I hot glue all the candy corn around it, facing out the point facing out.

And it looks like pinhead almost.

But with candy corn, it's adorable.

And then you throw it in the garbage where it belongs.

Karla Walsh: 00:13:34

You like it for crafts.

Have you seen those recipes where they melt it down and make it kind of like a homemade butterfinger?

George Duran: 00:13:40

Oh my gosh, no.

I mean, no.

Why would you do that?

Karla Walsh: 00:13:44

I mean, because butterfingers are delicious and maybe these are the.

For the people who don't like candy corn so they can turn it into something else.

George Duran: 00:13:51

Okay.

Straight in the garbage.

Do you know how they're made?

Karla Walsh: 00:13:55

No.

Fill me in.

George Duran: 00:13:57

Yeah.

Originally, workers heated a sugar based mixture, then hand poured the colors in separate stages into kernel shaped molds in starch trays.

But today, producing them with a machine called a Mogul, it can create around 8,000 to 15,000 pieces of candy corn per minute.

Karla Walsh: 00:14:14

Wow, that is so much more efficient.

That would take forever to do individually, but if memory serves, it's been a while since I've had a candy corn.

George Duran: 00:14:20

Main ingredients of candy corn, sugar, corn syrup, of course, dextrose, honey, and texturizers.

According to the American Chemical Society, manufacturers polish candy corn with a shellac based coating to give it that glossy appearance.

Some candy corn formulations also use carnauba wax, a natural wax derived from the Brazilian palm leaves.

I knew it.

They were using wax in that.

Karla Walsh: 00:14:42

Yeah, it's like the jelly bean coating too.

They spin them in like a little.

I watched many an episode of Unwrapped back in the day.

George Duran: 00:14:50

Do you remember the last time you ate one.

Karla Walsh: 00:14:52

Oh, it's probably been like a decade.

It's been a.

George Duran: 00:14:55

If you find a little jar somewhere that's offering, you don't even put one in your mouth to kind of like, taste it and be like, I know.

Karla Walsh: 00:14:59

I need to get back to it, because maybe it's like one of those things.

I tried some, like, Hostess snack cake recently.

I was like, wow, the formula has changed.

Or my palate has changed.

George Duran: 00:15:07

Here are some of the weirder shapes that they've made candy corn out of.

The pumpkin jack O Lanterns.

Like you said, the little pumpkin ones, they've made a acorn shaped candy corn.

Bats, black cats, witches, witches on broomstick, skulls, crossbones, owls, corn cobs, sheaves of wheat, jugs, Santa Claus, snowmen, and Christmas trees, all made out of the worst candy on earth.

Karla Walsh: 00:15:32

You're like, the corn was enough.

And now we have all of these iterations.

What are you doing?

George Duran: 00:15:36

You want to ruin Christmas also?

Karla Walsh: 00:15:38

Come on now.

George Duran: 00:15:40

In September of this year, Brach's launched Ode to candy corn, a $22 limited edition perfume with notes of vanilla, spun sugar, and honey.

Karla Walsh: 00:15:49

Oh, my gosh.

That has to just be like one of those shticks, you know, like marketing departments getting a little too creative.

George Duran: 00:15:55

I went online to find one to buy one for $22.

They're sold out everywhere.

But I did find one on eBay for $899.

Karla Walsh: 00:16:04

Oh, come on.

I could think of many other uses of $900 that I would prefer.

George Duran: 00:16:10

Yes.

Buy candy corn and throw it into.

Karla Walsh: 00:16:12

The river for the good of the collective.

George Duran: 00:16:16

Yes.

All right, we're going to play another game of treat or trash Candy corn edition.

You ready for this one?

Karla Walsh: 00:16:21

I'm ready.

George Duran: 00:16:22

Here are some of the flavors that candy corns were made into.

Or not.

You have to tell me which one's real and which one is fake.

That I made up.

Karla Walsh: 00:16:29

Okay.

I'm going to predict that I'm going to be terrible at this.

George Duran: 00:16:33

French onion soup.

Candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:16:35

Oh, that has to be fake.

George Duran: 00:16:36

Yeah, it's fake.

Of course it's fake.

I was trying to throw you off.

Hot dog.

Candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:16:42

I'm gonna say that is real.

George Duran: 00:16:45

That is real.

And yeah, that's right.

Part of Brach's tailgate candy corn collection.

Coffee.

Candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:16:51

I'm gonna say that's real.

People love coffee.

George Duran: 00:16:53

Yeah, it is real.

That makes sense.

Of course.

It tastes like a latte with wax in it.

Karla Walsh: 00:16:58

Everything I've ever wanted.

George Duran: 00:17:00

Mashed potatoes and gravy.

Candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:17:03

I'm gonna say that's real.

Seasonal.

George Duran: 00:17:05

Yes, it's fake.

However, Walgreens confirmed that Brach's actually experimented with a mashed potato flavor candy corn, but couldn't get the flavor right, so it was never made.

And that's why they're not broke.

Pickle juice, candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:17:23

Okay, on the heels of last time, I'm going to say that this is fake, and then I'm going to be wrong.

But it's fake.

George Duran: 00:17:29

It's fake.

That's right.

Karla Walsh: 00:17:30

Phew.

George Duran: 00:17:31

Green bean candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:17:33

I'm gonna say fake.

George Duran: 00:17:34

It's real.

That's right.

One of the six original Thanksgiving dinner flavors by Brach's.

Yes.

Somebody intentionally made a vegetable flavored Halloween candy.

Karla Walsh: 00:17:46

Wow.

So did they, like, have a Thanksgiving mix that was, like, all of the dinner in one bag?

George Duran: 00:17:51

Yep.

Including ginger glazed carrots.

Karla Walsh: 00:17:54

Oh, wow.

George Duran: 00:17:55

What about this one?

Ranch dressing.

Candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:17:58

Ooh.

As a Midwesterner, I'm really on the fence about this because we have ranch everything here.

Also.

I'm gonna say fake.

George Duran: 00:18:06

Yeah, it's fake.

That's right.

And what about cheeseburger with bacon candy corn?

Is that real or fake?

Karla Walsh: 00:18:11

I'm gonna say real.

George Duran: 00:18:13

That's fake.

Come on.

I made that one up.

That's an easy one.

Sweet potato pie, candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:18:18

That's real.

George Duran: 00:18:18

Of course it is.

One of the original Thanksgiving flavors.

Like we discussed before.

Stuffing, candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:18:25

That would be really hard to recreate because there's a lot of flavors going on in that.

I'm gonna say fake.

George Duran: 00:18:30

It's real.

Karla Walsh: 00:18:31

Ah.

Part of that same mix.

George Duran: 00:18:33

That's right.

Brach's is trying to do anything we can to ruin Thanksgiving.

Hamburger, candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:18:41

Fake.

George Duran: 00:18:42

That's real.

Karla Walsh: 00:18:43

Okay, we just had, like, a cheeseburger with bacon, and that was fake.

George Duran: 00:18:46

Come on.

Sold in the same tailgate collection as the hot dog.

That's right.

Ketchup and mustard, candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:18:54

I'm gonna say real.

I guess now in that same package.

George Duran: 00:18:57

Man, I'm just throwing you off here.

It's fake.

Karla Walsh: 00:19:00

Told you I was going to be bad at this game.

George Duran: 00:19:02

Roasted turkey, candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:19:04

Real.

George Duran: 00:19:05

Of course it's real.

There's Thanksgiving.

You can't have Thanksgiving candy corn without roasted turkey.

Flavored candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:19:12

I still don't want it to be real.

It doesn't need to exist.

George Duran: 00:19:14

But yeah, I bet you my kids would eat that over the roasted turkey too.

Karla Walsh: 00:19:18

That waxy texture is just so appetizing.

George Duran: 00:19:21

And finally, macaroni and cheese.

Candy corn.

Karla Walsh: 00:19:24

If Mac and cheese can be ice cream, it can be candy corn.

It's real.

George Duran: 00:19:28

That's fake.

I made that up.

Karla Walsh: 00:19:30

Ah, darn it.

I feel like Mac and cheese has been a lot of different things, so why not candy corn at this point?

George Duran: 00:19:36

Thanks so much for joining us on this Halloween candy adventure, Karla.

Anything you want from this show that we discussed, I'll send it to you for Halloween.

What do you think?

Anything that you like.

Karla Walsh: 00:19:44

Ooh, I want that caramel apple razor cookie treat.

George Duran: 00:19:51

Yes.

Karla Walsh: 00:19:52

Next time I come to town.

George Duran: 00:19:54

Yes.

I like your dark side, Karla.

That's awesome.

Karla Walsh: 00:19:57

How about you?

What can I bring in exchange?

George Duran: 00:20:00

Definitely not candy corn.

Just anything but candy corn.

How about that?

Karla Walsh: 00:20:04

Perfect.

Sold.

George Duran: 00:20:05

Thanks so much for being on the show, Karla.

Karla Walsh: 00:20:06

Thank you so much for having me, George.

George Duran: 00:20:08

Up next, we're talking to branding expert Jon Racinskas to find out how pumpkin spice became America's biggest fall obsession and why we keep falling for it year after year right after this.

Welcome back.

If you've ever wondered how pumpkin spice went from a simple spice blend to a full blown American obsession, you're in luck.

Joining us today is Jon Racinskas, creative director, filmmaker, host of the YouTube channel Creative Briefs, and perhaps most importantly, a proud dues paying member of the pumpkin spice latte army.

Jon, welcome to the show.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:21:07

Oh, hi, George.

Thanks so much for having me.

George Duran: 00:21:09

Jon, first of all, pumpkin spice, how on earth did this become so popular?

Where did it all start?

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:21:14

Its origins are ancient.

Actually, around the 8th century.

We're looking at the height of the spice root.

And pumpkin spice is a blend of four really important spices to the spice trade.

It's simply cinnamon, nutmeg, ginger, and cloves.

You know, this had traded for centuries, and eventually it found its way into American kitchens where it became the unofficial flavor of fall because we started blending it into pumpkin puree and making the ubiquitous Thanksgiving pumpkin pie.

George Duran: 00:21:51

Yeah, but we've taken it to a whole different level this day and age.

Right.

Like, this is not just pumpkin pie anymore.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:21:56

So in: 1934

And in: 2003

And here we are 23 years later, still talking about it.

There's actually a significant psychological component at play here.

George Duran: 00:22:19

I assume this really made it big for Starbucks.

Right.

And they don't call it like the fall harvest latte.

They're calling it pumpkin spice latte.

Clearly, there's no pumpkin flavor in there, but it's the spices that you use for pumpkin pieces.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:22:33

Right.

I mean, I like where you're going with fall harvest.

But pumpkin spice, those two words are shortcut to nostalgia.

Right?

This is the flavor of fall, and this predates, you know, Starbucks by a century.

George Duran: 00:22:48

And it's almost like Starbucks is like the king of pumpkin spice today.

Right?

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:22:53

Right.

That is the brilliance of Starbucks.

And the pumpkin spice latte.

Right.

We call this manufactured scarcity.

They could sell you a pumpkin spice latte in June, but you're not gonna want it.

It has meaning and nostalgia attached to it, and that is only applicable at certain times of year.

George Duran: 00:23:11

Do you think there's another spice or flavor that is like this?

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:23:13

You know, as I was preparing for this, I was thinking about what could the next pumpkin spice latte be?

And I think it's the lavender latte in spring.

Right?

Come on, think about it.

Right?

First warm day of spring, lavender cups come out.

Four weeks only, and then it's gone.

See you next year.

George Duran: 00:23:35

And you think people want to drink soap flavored lattes out there?

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:23:40

No.

I personally love a good lavender latte almost as much as I love a pumpkin spice latte.

George Duran: 00:23:46

Really?

George Duran: 00:23:47

There's nothing like pumpkin spice.

Nothing.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:23:50

There's really not.

It is tying into memory.

If you think about that pumpkin pie spice, it conjures up memories of.

Of Thanksgiving tables and people that are now long gone.

Right.

You are paying a premium to tap into this shared nostalgia, and people are willing to pay for it.

And that's why, you know, we're seeing the explosion of pumpkin spice everything.

It's because it works.

George Duran: 00:24:18

We have taken pumpkin spice to a whole different level, and I started digging deep and finding out some of the pumpkin spice flavors that we've integrated in our foods.

So here are some of the crazier products we've sold in the US with pumpkin spice flavor.

You ready?

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:24:33

I'm ready.

Let's do it.

George Duran: 00:24:34

Pumpkin Spice spam.

In: 2019

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:24:40

That seems like an act of desperation, Right?

Would you eat regular Spam pumpkin spice?

Sure.

Let's give it a shot.

George Duran: 00:24:47

Yeah.

Nissin, which is that noodle company, they come up with pumpkin spice cup noodles.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:24:54

Wow.

It is one of the more bizarre ones I've seen.

Yes.

George Duran: 00:24:57

Yeah.

Pumpkin spice bacon by Hatfield.

Karla Walsh: 00:25:00

Ooh.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:25:01

I could totally buy into that, right?

George Duran: 00:25:02

Yeah, totally.

Because you do like brown sugar and there's like, these warm spices.

Why not, right?

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:25:06

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

No, it's.

It's perfect for it.

George Duran: 00:25:09

In: 2012

Pringle chip.

Yep.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:25:14

Okay.

George Duran: 00:25:14

Pringles of course.

mpkin spice Mac and cheese in: 2020

Have you tried it?

I will not.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:25:21

It's an experience and didn't hate it.

George Duran: 00:25:25

Oh, that's not a positive thing to say.

I didn't hate it.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:25:29

Well, because it's pumpkin spice everything.

The bar is kind of low.

George Duran: 00:25:34

Yeah.

And then finally in: 2024

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:25:40

Pumpkin spice latte is a multisensory experience.

And its warmth, I think, is an essential part of a pumpkin spice product that lasts.

It has to have a certain multisensory blend.

And I don't believe the Slurpee is going to last because it's missing one of those critical components.

George Duran: 00:26:01

Well, tell me if some of these non edible pumpkin spice items would, would tickle you.

Pumpkin spice trash bags.

spice scented garbage bags in: 2023

It sold out in 90 minutes when they released it.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:26:15

Would you, wouldn't you want your trash can to smell inviting?

I guess.

George Duran: 00:26:22

Yeah.

It to smell like a pumpkin spice latte that's been spilled in the streets of New York City.

Sure.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:26:27

Better than the average trash bag left on the streets of New York City.

George Duran: 00:26:32

Special Kitty has sold pumpkin spice scented cat litter at Walmart.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:26:36

Do you really want to tempt people with, you know, such delightful flavors on cat litter?

George Duran: 00:26:45

Native offered a pumpkin spice latte scented deodorant.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:26:48

I've seen that.

George Duran: 00:26:49

And finally, Dawn released a limited edition pumpkin spice power wash that spray.

The power wash spray and pumpkin spice smell.

Wait, you're washing your dishes and then you're going to eat something off of it and it smells like pumpkin spice.

That's a little bizarre.

Yeah.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:27:03

And I think it's, it's, it's, it's sort of defeating the purpose of cleaning your plates.

A few pumpkin spice latte seasons ago, Trader Joe's introduced pumpkin spice hummus.

George Duran: 00:27:15

I mean, there's chocolate hummus, so I guess why not pumpkin spice hummus, Right.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:27:20

You know, hummus is a savory food.

Right.

This is a savory spice blend.

It works.

George Duran: 00:27:25

What is the next pumpkin spice phenomenon?

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:27:28

I think Oreo is great at pointing out where trends could go.

So Oreo is releasing all of these limited edition flavors.

I don't know if you've tried any of them.

There's chicken and waffles.

Don't recommend.

George Duran: 00:27:41

Oh, God.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:27:42

But one that I would is their deep fried Oreo flavor.

Oreo.

And it is, for me, it is the flavor of the state fair and the fact that Oreo is tapping into that might be meaningful.

Maybe the flavor of summer is deep fried.

I don't know.

George Duran: 00:28:00

Can't imagine what that would be like.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:28:01

I mean, this really just shows how hard a job it is being over in the marketing team over at Starbucks, right?

Because they're look, you know, they're looking for the next pumpkin spice latte.

And so they're floating a whole bunch of really terrible ideas right now.

And I'm sure the flavor of deep fried has come up in conversation.

George Duran: 00:28:20

Oh, my gosh.

Jon Ruscinskas, thank you so much for being on the show and giving us this insight on pumpkin spice.

skas, host of Creative Briefs: 00:28:26

Thanks so much.

I appreciate it.

Thanks for having me.

George Duran: 00:28:28

And you can learn more about [email protected], follow him on Instagram on https://www.instagram.com/jonracinskas/ and check out his YouTube channel, Creative Briefs https://www.youtube.com/@Creative_Briefs.

That's it for today's show.

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Until next time, I'm George Duran.

Stay hungry.